Welcome to Beyond Point to Point, the podcast where we go beyond pickup and delivery and dive deeper into the world of logistics, freight, and supply chain management. From industry trends to expert insights, we're here to help you navigate the complexities I'm your host, Joe Greek. And today, we're expanding our view far beyond borders. I'm your host, Joe Greek, and today we're expanding our view far beyond borders. We're diving into the world of international logistics, a segment of the supply chain where strategy, timing, and compliance matter more than ever. With trade policy shifting, tariff uncertainty rising, and global sourcing strategies in flux, international freight is once again at the center of disruption and opportunity. Whether it's moving product across oceans or across borders, shippers today need more than capacity. They need clarity, control, and the right partnerships to keep their supply chains moving. In this episode, we're taking a three part look at global logistics, from international strategy to cross border execution to the critical role of customs compliance. You'll hear from voices who work in it every day and understand what it takes to succeed when the world gets unpredictable. For the first point in today's route, I'm joined by Richard Egan, vice president of international solutions at Averitt. Richard leads our global logistics team, helping shippers navigate ocean and air freight, trade policy shifts, and international supply chain strategy. He brings a broad lens to the conversation and a deep understanding of what it takes to stay flexible in a volatile world. Let's dig into how global shippers can stay ahead of disruption and prepare for what may come next. Rich, thank you very much for being on the show today. It's great to have you here. Very much appreciate it. Now you bring several years of experience in the international shipping industry. And so let's get down to it right now. The big topic, of course, is tariffs. So when you're dealing with our international customers, what are you seeing in terms of their discussions on shifting strategies with their global supply chain strategy? Well, it it it you know, the current environment is, has hasn't changed much dynamically from what has happened over the last few years. COVID was the start of of companies that were looking at alternatives for their supply chain and from their origin, trying to, really separate their self a little bit from from China. The tariffs only accelerated that process. And if you go back into the fourth quarter of twenty twenty four, you saw companies that were already planning for the potential administration change that was happening in in January. So inventory levels were, in some cases increased and and to cover a period of time of risk. And and we all saw that once the tariffs were were implemented, especially in China. So there were a couple of different means of of combating that from a from a client standpoint. Some had increased inventories. We have one customer that, I met with personally and and had accelerated their inventory up to five months. To give their self, you know, a a small period of cushion in order to stop on on a trade basis to cover the the requirements that they have with their customers. The other is, another customer is diversified away from China, and they started that process a number of years ago. So, a good example of that is is, moving freight from, China to Vietnam of which this client did. Others kind of fell into a trap where they didn't get proactive and and were reactive, and they're feeling the ramifications. But the the trade decline because of the tariffs is as much in the US as sixty percent right now down. So, it's significant to see the the the volume change, that we've experienced over the last month. As a result of the the ongoing tariffs, which are kinda blanketed across the world, who are you seeing as the emerging winners of becoming sourcing alternatives to China? That's a great question, Joe. The number one beneficiary is is Mexico. We've seen that over the last few years. Near shoring has been something that's not new to the industry. I've seen near shoring depending on certain commodities, that took place back in the nineties and then through the two thousands. But it really didn't kick off as well because of certain, requirements within Mexico that have have changed in today's marketplace. So Mexico has been the number one, benefactor of of kind of the migration away from China. Other areas that were quite significant, were the India subcontinent region. So you've got India, you've got Pakistan, you've got Bangladesh. And then, alternatives within that Southeast Asian market are are also, quickly, gaining popularity. And Vietnam has been around for a long time. And so we've seen significant volume shift into the Vietnam market as well as Malaysia. But overall, Southeast Asia is also, seeing a benefit of of, you know, migration away from China. So as we see these emerging markets becoming great alternatives, how how does Averitt and the international team support shippers in making that kind of transition? That's, that's really what we do for as a company. I mean, we we offer, alternatives both from a pricing and a service, level. Mexico is is one that really stands out for us because of our cross border, group that we have supporting, Mexico to US on a northbound as well as Mexico to Canada for that matter for for product that has been shifted into that area. So that's kind of a reflection of our power of one that we talk about so often. The other is is giving our our our customers what they're looking for is is a landed cost model. And and we're able to provide the portion of that. Of course, we can't provide the, actual manufacturing, cost. But what we can do is give them a a cost from the manufacturing location in the alternative country directly to their doors so they can build that model when they're looking at a landed cost in order to migrate from one country to another. And with our strengths that we have in in in in Southeast Asia with our partners that we work with, we've got pricing that's competitive from all of those regions. Alright. So right now, we're seeing a significant decrease in transpacific volumes. Fewer container ships are arriving at the ports. Ultimately, this is gonna be mean less demand for, freight transportation, hopefully, in the short term. Now if we think back, back five years when we were first hit with COVID, we saw a similar pattern where, where ships were, doing blanket sailings and there was nothing at the ports. Then all of a sudden, we start to emerge and we see dozens and hundreds of ships at the ports waiting for, I don't know, dozens of days, months at a time to be unloaded, and it caused significant supply chain disruptions. Do you see something like that occurring this go around? It it it it will happen, but it's not gonna be anywhere near to the, impact, that we we experience in with COVID. You know, COVID had had, many tentacles within both the the, origin marketplace as well as the destination side. Labor was one of the biggest impacts that that affected that. So, whether it was China, Southeast Asia, but predominantly China, you know, workforces were, or manufacturing came to a standstill. That created, you know, that that stall effect that that we had within the supply chain, and it was the same thing that happened on the US side. Labor forces were were reduced and and, you know, the the industry was was seen as a a a necessity. So when product started to come back in, it hit on on at levels that were, much greater than what I would anticipate this time. And the reason for that is is what we talked about earlier. Companies that have diversified away from China, are still receiving, product, and and the supply chain has has been reduced, but not as negatively impacted, as the the impact we had during COVID. The other side of that is the the companies that have increased their inventory levels are still producing. You can go back during that period and and you would see shelves that were empty. In today's market, you know, we're not experiencing any of that that, that type of behavior even though the volume is coming down and we will see a slight impact as it as it returns. So I expect, what the carriers have done, which the blank sailings are are their way to, to affect supply and demand, but it's also their way to keep the prices, at a level as opposed to falling, you know, completely to the bottom of where where ocean freight rates would be, if in fact they had all of their vessels, flowing into the US. So I expect to see a a, a little bit of an impact. How significant will be is nothing towards the the COVID levels. Well, that that is good news, and hopefully, that will be the case. So if you were to give a shipper one bit of advice on how to future proof their supply chain, what would that be? If I had my crystal ball out, I could I could, give a a a great answer to that. But if I look at history, and that's really what what the the customer should be looking at is is, how were they impacted and and where were they impacted? So the the the advice I would give is is to mitigate those risks on a future basis. You know, we have a lot of years of experience. If you look at at our team on the, warehouse and distribution side, if you look at our cross border, our LTL network, go across all of our service, services that we offer to the customer. We've got a lot of of of people within our business that can can work close with those customers and offer suggestions that may be be helpful to them. But, I would just just give one bit of advice is to say, look at where their pain points were and plan better from a future standpoint. Because the ones who have planned, are the ones who are successful. And I think we we referred to one earlier. You know, eighty percent of their volume used to come out of China, and twenty percent came out of Vietnam. They've effectively canceled, bookings out of China right now because of the tariffs and have moved shifted a hundred percent of their their product over to Vietnam. And their future model will be eighty percent Vietnam and twenty percent China. So they've taken a proactive approach. And I think, my advice to customers would be, take similar actions to what that customer did. That's great. And you don't have to be proactive last week to start being proactive today. That's correct. That's correct. It's it's never too late to start looking at, what's gonna give you the the the value from a future transportation or supply chain solution for your business. You you it's it's never too late. You need to start looking at that today. Appreciate your time today, Rich. No. It's it's it's my pleasure, and and I appreciate you, looking at the international, part of our business, to to offer some solutions for our customers. Averitt has been delivering success for over half a century with passion, pride, and a powerful network. Introducing the Power of One, your single source for transportation and logistics. Our comprehensive services include LTL, truckload, dedicated, distribution and fulfillment, and integrated global solutions. But what truly sets us apart is our people dedicated to serving you. For any need, local or global, trust Averitt, the power of one. Now for the next point in our journey, we're heading to the border, literally. I'm joined by two guests who bring both sides of the US Mexico freight equation into focus. First, Ed Haib, vice president of Mexico sales at Averitt, works directly with shippers to help them navigate the fast changing world of cross border logistics. And joining him is Homero Gonzalez, journal director at Centro de Fletes, one of Averitt's trusted partner carriers in Mexico. Together, they provide a unique perspective on how a strong integrated partnership can remove barriers, reduce delays, and improve reliability on both sides of the border. From rising nearshoring demand to the realities of operating in two countries, Ed and Omero share what's changing in cross border logistics and how shippers can be prepared for what's ahead. Well, Ed, Omero, thank you very much for being on the show today. It's a pleasure to have you here. Now before we dive deep into our discussion, Omero, I would really like to hear about the story behind Central DeFletez. Oh, thank you very much. I'm Omero Gonzalez. I'm the general director for Cental de Fletes. And, yes, my family has been in trucking for eighty five years. So we've been around, all this time. First, my grandpa started the business. It was, at the beginning, not officially, a trucking company because there were no trucks or roads in Mexico. So my my grandpa started as a, as as a provider of services for a, lighting company in Mexico. Later on till nineteen fifty, he was, the one that received the seventh, permit to work in Mexico. So we're the seventh company to be recognized as a, trucking company in Mexico. So, all these years, we've been in trucking. We started in domestic services, sea containers. And when NAFTA started, my dad, which took, the CEO role many years after my my my grandpa, we started giving service from Mexico to US. And now we have been growing. And now, for us, maybe ninety percent of our revenue is, to the unit United States and from the United States. So we've been growing a lot, and thanks to international commerce. That is a very incredible and rich family history there, and congratulations on keeping keeping the name going after all these years. You know, with the growth in cross border trade, over the years, we've seen, you know, significant increases in near shoring and reshoring to North America and particularly to Mexico. Mhmm. Do you see that trend continuing? Yeah. Definitely. Geography, simple geography makes it a reality for the future. Sixty years plus of near shoring. So again, it's not something we just started. It's something that's been going on for sixty years. And it just makes sense to source, manufacturing plants close to home, if not at home. So I definitely see this trend in spite of all that we're seeing on the news today continuing, and we're very optimistic in the next couple of years of seeing it, taken off and exploding. Well, that's a good point about what we're seeing now, and, of course, that gets to the, touch point of tariffs. So, currently, how how do you see that impacting nearshoring and cross border transportation in general? And I'll let you, speak to that first, Alvaro. Of course. There there's been a huge impact, of course. I think it's changing all the way to the basis what, you were preparing to do and to sell to the United States. I'm from the United States. But I think Indiana's ad set, it's just logic. It's, physically, we're just besides the United States. So companies, short term, long term, it's a no, it's a win win decision to move their factories to Mexico. And I think even though the tariffs might have some impact in the long term, economics, the cultural, links between US and Mexico are gonna help to make it easier to make commerce between the two comp the two countries. What's your perspective on that, Ed? Well, I could tell you since, they even started talking about tariffs, we've seen an influx of freight, primarily customers in Mexico trying to get material out, before the tariffs so they could avoid it. So we were able to benefit from that. You know, we have a warehouse brand new in San Antonio, eighty five thousand square feet that's pretty much full because of two big customers out of Mexico who did that. But that will transition. That's short lived. You know, as things get worked out with the tariffs, you know, exactly what the tariffs will be or not be, we anticipate more of a shift back to what was going on with distribution at the border or further up the I thirty five corridor. It changed things, definitely. It put a pause to a certain extent, and people are figuring things out. I was recently in in Juarez visiting customers, large sized customers, and I heard things like we're shutting down in Mexico and opening up in El Paso. Others talked about shutting down production lines in China and bringing it to Mexico. And then there was one very large company, huge presence, US and Mexico, and it's basically business as usual, and they're continuing with their expansion plans across the board. Well, what what advice would you give to shippers at this point in time to avoid some of the common mistakes that you see with when it comes to cross border transportation between Mexico and the US? Yeah. You know, definitely, when doing cross border business or or thinking about it, look at ways to cut layers, unnecessary layers. Because it's already somewhat complicated And using more parties than necessary, adding additional steps than necessary will just make it even more complicated. And there's definitely, providers like an Averitt, like a Centrao de Fletes that together can offer streamlined solutions to customers, already in Mexico and looking to go to Mexico. So I would emphasize that. Really look at your supply chain, the transportation part, and how can it be as efficient as possible from point a to point b. Gotcha. Okay. And what what's your perspective on that, O'Mara? Oh, I totally agree with that. Try to cut as many layers as possible. And also, especially in hiring, Mexican companies, the legal, the legal positioning of each company. So if you can go and hire companies that have, certifications like CDPAD, OEA, and work with companies like Averitt, which they have knowledge on the market Mhmm. You would not have, nasty surprises of hiring maybe a cheap, provider, but that may have big problems in your operation. Mhmm. Yeah. Great insights. Mhmm. Well, part of the reason why you're here, Omero, is because Central de Fletes was named the twenty twenty five Averitt Integrated Mexico Truckload Carrier of the Year. So, you know, that kind of honor doesn't just come from nothing. So, Ed, maybe give me, your perspective on on on, the relationship that we have with Central and why they received this recognition. Definitely. Well, it's a relationship, I'm proud to say, going on beyond fifteen years, closer to twenty years. And at one time, when Averitt had their trailers going into Mexico, Centrel was actually pulling out trailers, Mexico side. So that right there shows the confidence that we had with have with Centrao de Fletes with our equipment because you know how important our equipment is, whether US or Mexico. So that's one thing. Plus, Homero was kinda alluding alluding to it. They do things to the book. You know what I mean? Whereas what could be somewhat common in Mexico, especially in the trucking business, there's a lot of companies that maybe cut corners here where they shouldn't, especially today with all these new regulations coming down. And that's exactly what Averitt looks for. You know, we we see Averitt in Centrada Fuertes. So a great working relationship over the years. Customers echo that because they love the service that we're able to provide as a team. Well, part of a strong relationship Mhmm. I think also comes from the ability to be creative and come up with solutions that are out of the box. So what are some of the unique solutions that we are able to offer shippers Definitely. As an alliance? Great. Well, one thing I always point out, there isn't an AVRD than Mexico. But we're able to offer all five verticals, all five services through strong partners like a Centrale de Fletes, who are in Mexico. And and some of those services, could get over the road, and they can get pretty, inventive, complicated. We do a lot of tequila loads, high value loads that involve armed escorts, convoys, and we're able to conduct that through Central de Fletes, experts in the tequila industry for many years. Our rail capabilities are extended into Mexico. And, again, partners like Central de Fletes have the ability to go to the major rail yards and even the ocean ports to pick up containers or drop off containers. And then finally, especially now with everything that's going on, expedited options within Mexico are being requested more and more. And we're happy to find out that, Central has sixty, doubles teams. Correct. We have, sixty team drivers. Mhmm. And we're look we always look up to Everett, and, we also have the local drayage service for intermodal services. We also service four of the main, seaports in Mexico, and we try to give solutions to customers. Mhmm. And as you said, Ed, the safety and security issues in Mexico are are are big. So we we help our customers to do a not a fix, but a, a tailored solution Mhmm. With you guys, which is out of the box. Mhmm. So with them being, really, a company that follow the rules by the book, but we think outside the box to give really good services, good solutions to customers. K. So, basically, the flexibility that customers know us for on the US side, we're able to extend that on the Mexican side through solid partners like Central de Filites. That's what we call the power of one. That's right. Well, cross border transportation is not as simple as shipping from Nashville to Dallas. So what are some of the challenges that a shipper looking to move freight across the border might encounter? And I think a lot of that could fall into customs brokerage and things of that nature. No. Definitely. Especially right now, hands down, the the biggest confusion at the border or, you know, people shipping Mexico, US, vice versa, is what do I have to pay now, you know, with the tariffs? Because it's ever changing. Every day, it's it's different. So it's not so much, services, you know, what kind of services, ground transportation wise that you can do for me. It's what kind of info can you give me about how the tariffs are gonna affect my product cost coming out of Mexico. There I you know, it just highlights the importance of a strong relationship with a a good customs broker. You know, a lot of people, I don't think, take that into consideration. They they look at how am I gonna move the freight physically, what trucking company I'm gonna work with. But the real biggest part that's very complicated, especially today, is the customs brokers part. So I would suggest to customers take the time and invest as much time finding the right fit for that. And for what it's worth, we have licensed customs brokers here at corporate experts, and we're able to offer that service as a package for any services we do Mexico. So that's a strength I think we bring to the table as well, especially today. Really streamlining the whole process. Now from what about from your side, Javier? The last, seminars and, congress have been about trucking and transportation. A lot of American shippers, and even shippers that had, experience but bad experience in Mexico, they've been asking me, what do I have to look for in a trucking company? And I tell them, hey. Certifications. You have to do the right bedding of, trucking companies just like every does Mhmm. In which they check the OEA, the city pad, done some brass strip, and they do a real audit on what you're doing as a trucking company because it's easy to get not the best company. And especially as you said, international commerce is not as easy as domestic. Mhmm. So you need to do a lot more of, checking the information, the right partner. So I I think Everett's doing a great job, and I think if you wanna do international commerce to Mexico, betting your providers is a necessary step. Mhmm. Certainly. Because I would imagine when you're working with companies that are cutting corners, that can eventually come back to bite you. Very much so. And and and, again, Averitt, takes the time to look at who we're working with in Mexico because the last thing we wanna do is put at risk a long term relationship with a customer we've been working with in the US because of a bad experience in Mexico. Ever since we allowed our trailers in Mexico, that was a big part of the process, the vending process. We would actually go meet the carriers, check out their facilities, different certificates, insurance, etcetera. And now that we have the integrated group and that, exposures expanded even more to hundreds and or thousands of potential partners, it's even more important in today's environment to continue that vetting process. Certainly. Yeah. And also in the case the, with Everett, it's beautiful that my team, my people working in Mexico, they're talking to people here in Cookeville Yes. Headquarters. And they just don't speak Spanish. They're bicultural. So the relationship with my people working in Mexico, with customers in Mexico, it's great. Mhmm. It's great to have people here at Abritt that are bicultural, that know how to talk to people to, give solutions. Mhmm. That is just us. Yeah. That is perfect, and my people are happy to work with you guys. And I see customers also are happy to work with Averitt. So that's a spot on solution. Mhmm. Congratulations, my friend. Thank you. Romero, congratulations for all the hard work that you and your team have done, and we really appreciate both of you being on the show today. Oh, thank you very much, and it's been an honor to receive that award. For us working with Everett, it it's it's really amazing. And, yesterday, I got, this tour from Alice, and I was talking to Ed, Steve, Christie that we have so much in common with Everett that it's it's like talking back to my dad, to my granddad, all those values, core values you have. It it's amazing to work with such a, honorable, US company that share the same values in which we are by the book. We take care of our people. We take care of the community, and we see those long term relationships. Excellent. We try to find those relationships with our friends, Mhmm. Associates, customers, not just a spot service, but a long term relationship. And I think Everett is is the way to go. Delays at the border slowing your supply chain down? Our Mexico cross border services offer a fast track solution. Enjoy seamless logistics, timely deliveries, and hassle free border crossings. When you choose Averitt for streamlined cross border solutions, you unlock new opportunities with our expert services, including door to door LTL, truckload, and customs clearance. Averitt, that's the power of one. And for the final point on today's route, we're talking compliance. I'm joined by Kehlani Lawson, a licensed custom broker here at Averitt. She works behind the scenes to help shippers avoid costly delays, fines, and frustrations at ports and along the borders. From paperwork errors to misclassified goods, she's seen the most common and most preventable mistakes companies make when moving freight internationally. Kehlani helps us understand how better planning and broker relationships can unlock smoother customs clearance and keep shipments moving. Kehlani, thank you very much for being on the show today. First question I would like to ask you, could you give us a high level overview of what the customs brokerage process is when it comes to imports and exports? So, basically, we get the documents. We wanna make sure that they're compliant, that they have everything that they need. We wanna help them basically save some time and money. Our job is gonna be to keep them informed, compliant, get it from port to door with no problems. It's kind of what we're there for, so we try to take the the headache out of it. That's why most of them don't do it for themselves. Well, that that's a a good point. So can shippers actually do it for themselves, or do they have to use a licensed customs broker? No. They don't have to. They can do it for themselves, but there are a lot of pain points with it. And we're a team that's already sitting there managing those things. So we're trying to stay compliant. There's a lot of changing changes that come out. So we're already reading those, trying to stay on top of everything, trying to lead them the right direction. We don't want anyone to do anything that would cause their company any issues. So that we're already doing those things, and that's usually why they come to customs brokers. Gotcha. Well, for, a shipper that is going to import from, let's say, Asia into the US, what kind of advice do you generally give them before the freight gets on the water? So, generally, they, would want to know kind of what the tariffs are gonna look like for them. They're changing right now. There's been a lot of changes actually come out with not only the freight, but steel, aluminum, things like that that could affect their freight. So we want them to stay on top of those things. Just stay in communication with us, Be transparent about, what they're shipping. Any details they can give us, the better. And if they can make sure that their bonds and everything like that are up to date, and cover enough for the tariffs, That's pretty much all they can really do. We we try to lead them along the way as things change. So Well, that's a great point because tariffs are changing a lot, recently. So that made me wonder if, cargo is on the ocean and then tariff on that cargo changes while it's on the ocean, does that impact the the tariff rate that the shipper is gonna pay when it gets into the US? That one's kind of a difficult one to answer because we've we've seen all situations happen. They have imposed tariffs all of a sudden and effective immediately, but they've also imposed them to where it might depend on the date that it is shipped out of, the last port. So if it's coming out of, let's say, China, but it has a transship, maybe along the way, then it's actually the date of the transship. So it's kind of unpredictable. We just have to go with whatever our, admin administration comes up with. So we just as they come up with those dates, we try to just communicate it to the customer so they know what to expect along the way. Gotcha. And so when it comes to keeping track of the tariffs, how does your team go about doing that? Well, we get automatic updates from customs. They send those out to us. We read through. We make sure that we understand. We talk to them to each other. We make sure that everybody's on the same page. We'll, talk to other brokers that we can ask questions to if there's anything that's questionable. There's also customs, information for us to go to for, you know, any other questions that others are coming up with and asking questions about if something is not very clear. There's, just so much information that comes out usually that we have to pretty much put our heads together and make sure that everybody's on the same page and everybody understands, but it's just part of a moving target. Well, I think if I were a shipper, I would rather rely on you to do that than myself. That's what we were already sitting there doing. So Well, given the tariffs, you know, it increases the cost of goods moving. And so part of the international shipment process, also involves, cargo insurance. So are you having to advise customers to increase their coverage as a result of the tariffs? Yeah. That's something we're definitely talking to them about. The landed cost will change as tariffs increase, and we don't want something to happen to their freight and then end up being underinsured. That would be a tragedy. So we try to make sure we used to say ten percent, at least ten percent over just to cover tariff cost. But the sooner they can get us the documents and we can kinda calculate what their tariffs are gonna look like, the better it is to be able to communicate that with them. So we just suggest that they give us documents pretty much as soon as it leaves the port. Does the customs process work the same with, International Air and International Ocean? Is it essentially the same process? It's basically the same process. There's a couple things on our side behind the scenes that's different. But, yeah, we still need the same documents. We still need a lead time. The lead time is much smaller with Air, but we're we're still gonna be able to calculate their, tariffs and such. There's a couple of costs that might not like, the harbor maintenance fee isn't gonna come into place if it's not on a vessel, so that's one thing that would change. Right now, what common kind of advice would you give your customers to help them future proof their supply chain right now? I would think the biggest thing would be making sure their continuous bond is in order and at a amount that's going to cover their freight to allow for the additional tariffs. And just to continue communicating with us and being as as transparent as possible because we're not gonna be able to properly help guide them, the right direction if we don't have all the information. So the more that they can give us, the better. Open communication Absolutely. Is always the the first line of, building a great partnership. Yes. Kehlani, thank you very much. I appreciate you. Thank you. Now let's take a moment to recap. We began with Richard Egan, who gave us a global view of today's international supply chain, from shifting trade policies to the long term impacts of sourcing decisions. He reminded us that flexibility and strategic planning are key when the global landscape is constantly evolving. Then we shifted to cross border conversations with Ed Habe and Omero Gonzalez. Together, they shared both the US and Mexico perspectives on what it takes to keep freight moving smoothly across the border. From building strong partnerships to avoiding common pitfalls, they gave us a real world look at how nearshoring is changing the game and why having aligned teams on both sides matters more than ever. Finally, Kehlani brought it all home with a practical look at customs compliance. Her behind the scenes experience as a licensed custom broker highlighted how small oversights can lead to major delays and how preparation, planning, and the right expertise can keep shipments moving across borders with confidence. Thanks for listening to Beyond Point two Point. Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss what's next, and we'll see you on the next episode.
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